Anjem Choudary, UK Muslim, professional dole recipient and demented Islamist mouthpiece of Islam4UK, burnt a US flag in London to cries of “Burn, burn democracy”, “democracy, go to hell”, “democracy, you will pay”:
Just before September 11th, In Pakistan a Christian man, woman and their four children were burned to death by Islamists.
Various police checkpoints were set on fire by Muslims in Afghanistan.
In Indonesia, a Christian was stabbed in the stomach and a pastor battered with a plank.
On September 11th, 115,000 babies were aborted, many burned alive with salt solution.
Anglican and other Christian leaders – not to mention Obama, less anointed politicians, Vatican officials, UN officials and uncle Tom Cobley and all – wrung their hands and pleaded with would-be Koran burners not to do it, while studiously ignoring all of the above.
Terry Jones did not burn any Korans.
Which just goes to show that it’s easier and more personally satisfying to concentrate on the inconsequential than what really matters and that grovelling to bullies in an attempt to appease them is a complete waste of time.
Have a hard time seeing how you call the burning of Qurans by CHRISTIANS inconsquential…
Even if they are a cult- they are a cult who call themselves by the name of Jesus Christ- their church politics and doctrines may stink, but we have no right to judge whether or not they are actually Christians-
Didn’t Jesus say to turn the other cheek- or are we to go out there and bomb the living daylights out of the abortion clinics, the Pakistanis, the Afghanis, the Indonesian and oh yes, find the guy in the UK and kill him too?
Yaweh didn’t tell the Israelites to go protest at the Baals and Molechs that were routinely burning infant sacrifices- nor did he even tell them to object to the pagans- they were told to obey God’s law and take in the stranger.
Spiritual warfare is not done in the physical realm- but in the spirit and requires a pure heart and mind not a sarcastic cynical diatribe against fellow believers.
Yes, all of those things are horrendous- in fact this year millions of Yeshua’s followers will be martyred.
That does not give Christians leave to retaliate in kind.
Are we followers of the Prince of Peace or do we somehow have the right to fight fire with fire?
I really do not understand your attitude that there was ‘wringing of hand’- Obama didn’t wring his hands- he was very forthright as was Gates etc-
This is not a time to be divisive and subversive- attacking fellow believers but a time to unite in prayer and love and standing together in this time of persecution of the church.
Maribeth,
If I’m reading David correctly, he is saying that the death of 115,000 unborn children dwarfs the antics of book burners and the (relatively) small number of religious attack victims -and yet there is no outrage.
Peace,
Jim
I suppose you may have a point Jim except that abortions are protested all the time. In fact someone died in those protests, gunned down in a church not too long ago-
All of the things mentioned by David ARE protested and there is outrage.
IMHO the media colluded to make Jones an international figure and from there, a Christian response had to be made- without the media, even if it had happened, it would have little effect.
Christians are called to a life of death- death to the self-life – not to causing it in others.
And now for something very different:
http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/what-if-this-was-what-muslims-thought-of-christians#respond
I’m glad that, thus far, the spirit of Michael Spencer lives on.
Not the members, but we sure do have the right to judge whether or not the leaders and the organization are Christians. That man is not a Christian pastor.
I am inclined to agree with Jim (2). The point that I got out of this is that our western leadership (including here in Canada) is quick to defend and pander to islam, while at the same time equally quick to attack and critisize anything that is truly Christain. The leadership in the west and here in Canada seem to be blind to the fact that it is islam that is violent, hateful, intolerant, brutal, and murderous. They also seem to be equally blind to the fact that it is Christianity that offers God’s Love and Salvaltion, and that it is Christians that do the most amount of good in this world and in this country.
Do not missinterpret this as being “judgemental”. It is simply a statement of facts.
I am truly well aware of how terrible Islam is- used to teach on it so am very aware- but what concerns me is the amount of CHRISTIAN anger and hatred being expressed. I haven’t seen a lot of Anti-Christian stuff in Canada- but our media is a bit different and perhaps I’m just not so into Cdn media-
I just think you can be Christian and rational at the same time and I don’t see how being hateful and cynical advances the cause of Christ… I think we have to be careful to look at both sides and not get drawn in to the agenda of either right or left but to discern and try and keep focused on the Lord.
We are IN the world but not supposed to be OF it- we aren’t better than our Master- so Christians under persecution are to be expected are they not? We aren’t supposed to be fighting with the same weapons the world uses- but do spiritual battle instead?
I’m not sure how we can be considered to be pandering to Islam when both Canada and the US are AT WAR against Muslims.
Unfortunately, both countries have embraced freedom of religion, Islam takes advantage of that and in order to maintain their own ideals, Can and the US have to give that freedom… I see it more as Islam taking advantage than that ‘leadership setting out to pander’…
We’re told to pray for our leaders- not bash them- no one is perfect so why do we think they should be?
My perspective is that we are to love those in our immediate circle- If we follow Paul’s exhortation, we obey the authorities, not fight them… even if we’re slaves- if we take the Bible literally anyway-
I don’t hear Jesus being sarcastic except with those who called themselves by their faith- not with the ‘world’ who have no real alternative strength against the enemy until they embrace Jesus and have the power of Holy Spirit.
I don’t see how we have the right to hold pagans and unbelievers to Christian standards when they have no life in them to enable them to meet them… Are we not to LOVE them into the kingdom? Browbeating doesn’t seem to get them there.
I don’t know how people who don’t have ‘spiritual eyes’ to see can be expected to see anything of the Light… Jesus didn’t defend himself so why should we? Shouldn’t we just be going about our business, being light and salt and let God look after the rest? Maybe that’s simplistic but it’s how I see it (today).
Lots of questions- not so many answers… we have to live faithful before God I guess and leave judgment of others to Him.
Seems like I was repetitious but there it is.
8^) m
Hello Maribeth,
You wrote:
“I’m not sure how we can be considered to be pandering to Islam when both Canada and the US are AT WAR against Muslims.”
I must disagree. Canada is not AT WAR against muslims! We are fighting against those who pretend to be muslim. We are fighting against those who attacked the USA on September 11th, 2001. And if you were to take some time to talk with ANY of our soldiers who have served Canada in the Afghanistan mission, you would know that we are doing so much more to help the people of that country than anything else.
I don’t think any of us commenting here have the knowledge to state with certainty what real Islam is, or isn’t.
Sorry, I must disagree- Those we are fighting are definitely Muslims, following the instructions in the Quran for how to deal with ‘Infidels’ – anyone and everyone non-Muslim.
I would wager big money that you would not find one Taliban soldier who is NOT Muslim.
That moderate Muslims do not follow those instructions in no way alters the fact that Jihad is very much part of the doctrine of Islam.
I don’t argue that our troops are doing humanitarian activities as well.
As to who has knowledge of Islam, I have spent quite sometime studying Islam and while I’m certainly not an expert I do know a fair bit about their doctrines, beliefs and history.
I also worked in an office where the employees were almost all Muslim and frankly, among the youth, the respect and love for each other far surpassed anything I’ve ever seen among ‘normal’ Canadian and even groups of “Christian” youth. I’m not against Muslims- but I do know some of what is in their belief system. There are things under Sharia law that are abhorrent – like female circumcision and death to those who convert to anything from Islam, the denial of all rights to women etc.
However, my point in my post was that racial hatred from Christians betrays our Lord. If we are going to call ourselves by His Name, then it behooves us to ACT according to His Character and instructions… ie ‘love your neighbour as yourself’.
For more info on Islam – just 3 points- but actually I stand corrected re what the Imam in NYC is saying…
my bad.
http://www.youtube.com/user/TheWhiteR0ses